I love prayer… Why work toward making a situation better when you can just ask and wait for someone else to do it?
The failure state and irrefutable explanation is even built right into it. Did you pray for something and it didn’t happen? It’s because God didn’t will it, it’s part of his plan, beyond your comprehension but clearly for the best.
Also, pray hard, but remember God only helps those who help themselves.
And he already has a plan
“God helps those who suck up to him relentlessly.”
Unless it’s not in his plan.
They know that when Jesus made the endless bread and fish (with a meal purchase at Olive Garden) he definitely limited who could get it based on income and passing a drug test.
If Jesus came to school with a loaf of bread and a couple fish, he’d feed everyone.
And then get sued.
A middle eastern religious extremist walking through an American public school talking and feeding kids would probably be shot and killed live on national television. Possibly by a student.
To be fair, according to the stories, he was publicly killed in his time too.
Matthew 6:5-6
“And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you."
The thing about the bible is that there are some solid parables nestled in there about how to be a halfway decent human being. But then we get prose like this that reek of good intent, but have barn-door sized holes in the grammar thanks in part to being re-translated and edited many times over the centuries. Heck, a new edition dropped just last week.
For example:
Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full.
Oh, so if I act like a hypocrite, I’m good to go? Huh, sounds like Matthew had this one wrong.
I think someone would have to want to read it that way, to interpret it that way.
I mean, I’m not religious myself. However, to me, hes saying they got their reward (being seen praying) and they won’t get anymore reward than that. If they prey privately, their God will reward them.
Exactly. I’m not saying that’s a valid interpretation given the context, but rather I’m illustrating that given the intent to justify one’s own (bad) behavior, the text is easily abused. Which is a problem.
I see, yeah that makes sense.
That’s not how I interpret that line. I’m pretty sure he means that if you act like a hypocrite, the scorn and derision of the people you are annoying that you get here in life is the only reward you can expect, and no further reward will be gained in the afterlife.
However, if you follow the rules, are a good person, and most importantly don’t go around boasting about how good you are, then you’ll receive a greater reward after death, than any earthly reward that us lowly humans could give you.
We worship Capitalism, it’s on the money.
In God we Trust One Doll
Ed States of A, it was right under our noses
It’s like “believe in God and he will provide” fuck that noise, we need action and belief. We need proactiveness. We need people to act not just believe.
FFS, the only person who was only ever able to provide like that in the bible was Jesus. And there was always a prerequisite to it - he had to have something he could multiply - he didn’t conjure wine out of nowhere, he needed water to convert. He didn’t randomly produce the food for 5000 he needed fish and bread to begin with.
Even in the bible people had to at least do the bare minimum for shit to happen. These guys are withholding even that and saying prayer is the answer. Like it’s a cure all, it’s not, and it never was.
Yep. These idiots actually try to say (and maybe even believe) that if you pray hard enough, the loaves and fishes will appear.
It’s such a stupid thing to say too. I got into an argument with a relative about it recently. By the Bible’s own rules, a Christian who tells someone hungry to pray a little harder instead of just feeding them isn’t a Christian, and they’re damned. This whole “God helps those who help themselves” bootstrap/prosperity Christianity is the worst type of religion.
What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.”
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
James 2 14-19
Even in the bible people had to at least do the bare minimum for shit to happen
Beyond that, there are a lot of good behaviour and principles in there: while some insist on faith alone, it is abundantly clear that the gospel demands action, as there are a plenty of parables for people to listen - they tell you how to behave and how to act in the world - . If you have faith and that brings to actions and good deeds, fine, if you use faith as a trump card (ah, see what I did there), you’re doing something wrong. I have read the faith only arguments, but I will strongly disagree with them. If anything the whole point of the gospel is too act and not to be too formal about it. But I am a little skinny ape, I think as one, and apes like action.
Hmmm. A Christian believing something that doesn’t make sense because it’s not* in the Bible?
By any chance, does that belief help them give into their sinful nature and pretend god is cool with it? The usual: laziness, greed, hatred, dishonesty, etc.
- also applies to things that ARE in the Bible
Imagine a religion that isn’t based on “us vs. them”… Oh, right. You’d literally have to, as it hasn’t ever existed.
Buddhism and Taoism are such a way, I believe. Beliefs where there isn’t really good and evil, just creation and destruction as two halves of a cycle.
Both are bloody AF, and not that long ago. Neither are simply an outlook, and millions throughout history have been murdered in their name.
More to the point, any “higher power” that designates individuals/groups as “good” or “evil” based on its own internal system is exactly what I’m talking about. Anything beyond that is merely classifying it as something closer to a religion with each step toward dictating followers’ behavior.
Lets all pray to Crom. He never disappoints because he never cares. He already gave you all he’s giving you at birth. Plus there’s the whole riddle of steel thing
This looks like one of those weird Facebook text post options. It’s just missing the silly laughing emojis scattered about
Just eat the prayers, the way the people of Haiti just ate those bibles given to them (they didn’t do that, they starved).
so it’s plausible that they could be eating the old testament in gaza 👢 I tell ya man, some people…
Something something actions louder than words
So, ALL people of that faith think that way or just some? I just want to make sure I read OPs pic correctly.
A majority of voters of that faith, especially in key states, and that’s all that really matters here.
You must know a lot of people in that faith then? Whatever faith that OP is mentioning. Otherwise to say ALL of that specific faith are bad would be a logical fallacy.
You must be a person of that faith have such a persecution complex in Atheist Memes of all places.
Nobody said all. But either the voice is of the majority, or the majority is complicit in what the vocal minority is saying, and that’s just as bad.
Imagine a dichotomy so false that that a peaceful group with an earnestly held spiritual belief is somehow held responsible for a problem that hasn’t existed since 1946.
I thought the claim was more that a lot of Christians oppose these programs, not that they don’t exist
A program like this exists and was put in place by an America that was far more Christian than it is now.
And? “Fake Christian” is a mouthful and obviously they would disagree that they’re frauds
I’m not sure what your comment has to do with my statement
Ah yes, Christianity, a peaceful group. Like when they peacefully did those Crusades or had that peaceful Spanish Inquisition or when they peacefully forcibly converted indigenous people the world over. And let’s not forget how they’re peacefully calling for the death penalty for queer people in Christian countries like Uganda…
Peace everywhere from peaceful Christians!
Almost exclusively describing Catholic historical events and many of them in isolation. The Byzantine empire was under constant siege from pagans and Muslims for over a thousand years.
As far as murder of gays in Africa… pinning that on Christians is… ridiculous. Protections for homosexuals in historically Christian countries is far better than the alternatives. You act as if the animists or muslims in Uganda would be totally fine with homosexuality if it wasn’t for the oppressive Christians.
I can cherry pick the history of any group to show them in a bad light. I could say atheists killed 26 million in the holodomor or that secular humanists supported eugenics programs that inspired Hitler and started abortion centers to keep the population of undesirables down.
The reality is that human beings commit atrocities under many banners but a cursory look at Christian statements of faith and their actual scriptures will reveal that Christianity is radically peaceful and is the origin of any secular concepts concerning human protections in the Western world.
“Muslims also do bad things, because people everywhere do bad things, therefore the things Christians have done aren’t bad, and anyway, only some Christians have done them, therefore Christians are, in your words, a peaceful group” is the worst argument I’ve heard in a very long times.
People are inherently sinful. It’s a fact and also a fundamental belief of Christianity. As a result even if you give human beings a blueprint for a virtuous and peaceful life they will often ignore it or worse do something inherently sinful under the banner of Christendom. It’s human nature.
What I can say with confidence is that if a Christian lives according to doctrine they will live the best, most compassionate life possible. If they ignore it then they will live like anyone else. Mohammed bought & sold slaves. There is a difference.
Modern progessives have no idea how much of their worldview originates in Christianity. Go sincerely read the New Testament and the teachings of Jesus Christ instead of pointing fingers as to why a fallen world is fallen. You will find teachings that champion the poor and down trodden in a way that is radical even today.
More importantly the lunch program has been in place for over 70 years and was created by an America far more Christian than it is now so this “meme” is crap.
Sin is a transgression against a specific god. Your god is not the god of the majority of the Earth’s population, so no, they are not inherently sinful just because you have declared them so and your And I have read the New Testament. You read it. Especially John 3:18 where Jesus condemns anyone in the world who doesn’t worship him to eternal torture.
He also says to follow all of the abhorrent Old Testament laws. That’s what the “not one jot or tittle” passage is about.
Also, if you want to credit a school lunch program which is highly inadequate in feeding the most needy with Christianity, you’ll also have to credit the Holocaust, which was supported by a large number of German Christians, both Catholic and Protestant, who accepted the idea that their God wanted all the Jews dead.
Christians are not peaceful. They never have been. That’s just a lie. You can’t both do violent things and be peaceful.
I can’t wait for you to No True Scotsman away all of those Christians. I assume that will be your next step.
I can’t wait for you to No True Scotsman away all of those Christians
I’ve already explained that people are inherently sinful and capable of committing atrocities when they don’t follow Christ’s teachings so I’m not going to readdress this point.
you’ll also have to credit the Holocaust, which was supported by a large number of German Christians, both Catholic and Protestant, who accepted the idea that their God wanted all the Jews dead
I don’t have to accept anything much less that their hypothetical exegesis has no grounds in any of the church fathers or even modern theological opinion. Any Christian undertone in National Socialism was exactly that, an undertone. The Nazis leveraged any social identity that wasn’t nailed down and arced it towards a human agenda in this world. That’s not Christianity. That’s something else. If you disagree find the passage in the NT where Jesus says Christians should kill all Jews.
More importantly who defeated Hitler? Christians. In large part it was Orthodox Christians from Russia who were being terrorized by an atheist communist regime at home that was murdering their clergy, destroying churches, throwing their citizens in gulags and starving their population to death. They were forced into the battlefield, often without even a rifle, to fight the Germans and they succeeded. Europe has had 70+ years of relative peace since then.
He also says to follow all of the abhorrent Old Testament laws. That’s what the “not one jot or tittle” passage is about.
Wrong. Christians are bound by ten commandments and the other moral teachings but circumcision is no longer required, the Sabbath day was changed, dietary laws were relaxed to the point of not existing and most importantly salvation was extended to the gentiles and the brutal punishments of the Old Testament were done away with. Christians don’t pass their sins to a chicken and slaughter it instead we confess our sins to one another and seek absolution at the foot of the cross.
Sin is a transgression against a specific god. Your god is not the god of the majority of the Earth’s population, so no, they are not inherently sinful just because you have declared them so and your And I have read the New Testament. You read it. Especially John 3:18 where Jesus condemns anyone in the world who doesn’t worship him to eternal torture.
Sin is sin and there is only one God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit. I don’t declare them as sinners, God does. You know that I’m going to say this since you’ve read New Testament. I’m Orthodox so we have a slightly different but much older, early Christian view of hell. Essentially hell and heaven are the same thing, an experience of God. For those that are sanctified the experience is heaven and for those that are not it is hell. Atheists always equate the heaven or hell debacle to some megalomania when in reality worshiping and serving God is objectively the best thing for man to do. It is the ultimate fulfillment of life on Earth to live in humility, generosity, compassion for fellow man and reverence before the Creator. Everything that is good flows from Him so by worshiping God in earnest man is capable of “Theosis” (e.g. partaking in the energies of God) To turn away from God is hell.
Sin is sin and there is only one God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit.
The vast majority of the world disagrees with you. You don’t get to push your ideas of sin on them.
Also, I so called you’d go No True Scotsman.
Can you try making sense?
Read the wikipedia link. Free and subsidized lunch programs have been in place at a Federal level since 1946. They existed at a community level far before that into the 19th century. I can tell you from my own community that there are programs that extend beyond just this program as well when you factor in state-level support and charities.
No one said those programs don’t exist. It was pointed out that people want them not to. They’ve been whining about “handouts” including school lunches for decades. Why are you distracting from that fact?
In that case it sounds like the less Christian America becomes the more people feel it’s morally okay suspend programs that serve the underprivileged.
Yeah so? Christianity if practiced in a Christlike way would be fine. We don’t need to relentlessly specify that today’s Christians are full of shit. We’re just calling them how they identify themselves
Most “Christians” today are secularists which is why they are so morally pliable. There is no right or wrong in the post-modern world only rabid pursuit of self. This naturally has consequences. The less Christian the United States becomes the more this will increase.
Dude you’re insane. Christianity is not even close to what’s held morality together. In fact it’s been used as an excuse to be horrifically shitty over and over. Crusades as one old example
Atheists /secularists do kind and selfless things all the time. And again, if Christians practice what they preach they’re good for the world, mostly.
Christians are super prejudiced against poor and foreigners in the US.
