In over 30 years of practice, Dr. Errol Billinkoff rarely saw a man without kids come into his Winnipeg clinic to get a vasectomy. But since the pandemic began, he says it’s become an almost daily occurrence.
And he’s not alone.
“At first, I thought I was the only one who was noticing this,” Billinkoff, who brought a no-scalpel vasectomy procedure to Winnipeg in the early 1990s, told CBC News in a November interview.
“But I am part of an international chat group where doctors who do vasectomies participate and the topic came up, and it’s like everybody notices it.”
I got one because the idea of having kids has always filled me with a keen sense of dread. Any time I hear that someone is expecting a child my first thought is “oh no I’m so sorry” before saying the expected congratulations.
Both my partner and I don’t like or want kids, why risk accidents happening?
More people seem to be choosing child free living because of the state of the world and economy rn. I don’t blame them.
Get pets like me!
I bet they don’t get the same amount a shit a childless woman would going in to get her tubes tied.
I’ve (27m) been told no by multiple doctors. So, sorta? Granted. Last time I tried I was 24 but I hasn’t been easy. Maybe it would be now. I stopped trying.
Weird, you need to find yourself a new doctor. I got mine at 23 and the first time I ever spoke to any doctor that seemed like they were against it was actually only a few months ago, I’m 28 now. Even then they didn’t really seem like they were against it so much as they didn’t seem to understand why anyone would want one so young.
When I first asked my gen prac about getting snipped he said it was a little unusual for someone as young as me but he said that while actively putting in the referal so it isn’t like he was trying to talk me out of it. At the urologist he just asked the standard quick questions of “you understand that it is permanent?” And " you’re sure?". Then he put me on a table and got to work.
As a humerous side note, there is one thing I didn’t like about getting mine done so young. My urologist (and likely urologists in general) are used to performing vasectomies on much older guys who have a fair bit more scrotal droop to work with. Young perky me didn’t have that much droop. It also didn’t help that the sterilizing wash the sadists used was ice cold and the room where it was done was freezing. So my poor frozen bits were trying to ascend to party with my tonsils meanwhile this doctor was pulling on them like they were excalibur and he was itching to be crowned king of england just to try and get some slack to work with. Definitely did not enjoy that part. Still worth it though.
When I do smoking cessation education and I talk about how nicotine paralyzes your cillia (little hair / whip things that keep your respiratory tract clean) so when you quit they wake up to all this cigarette gunk, I like to describe it thus: imagine somebody came into your work and roofied you then smeared shit all over the floor walls and ceiling. You’d wake up like WHAT THE FUCK. Anyway that’s why you’re hacking up tar-mucous balls right after you quit; your cillia are PISSED. More medical education needs more memorable descriptions to increase retention.
The female procedure is a lot more invasive than the male procedure. That’s why I had mine done instead of my wife undergoing the surgery.
.
And, yes I do realize that’s not the point you were trying to make. But it is a factor.
The factor is the self appointed managers of women’s biology. They don’t want them women to steal kids from some future man. This is the basic line fed a woman I knew who wanted to be sterilized since her family carried the genes for a deadly dehumanizing genetic disease and some shithead doctor told her she was selfish for not wanting her future man to have a choice about kids. She left the southern us and went up north to get he procedure done. When she returned she found a new doctor. This was over twenty years ago. Long before this latest batch of idiots.
There are plenty of socially acceptable ways a woman can use to prevent pregnancy.
Yes like tubal ligation. Its very socially acceptable procedure unless your society is a bunch of freedom hating trash. Its only the immoral right that think they have the right to freedom of choice. Their choice only of course.
Going off the negative reaction to my comment, I guess people don’t know about the multiple different versions of the pill. There is also that thing that gets inserted in their arm… I am sure there are plenty more that I don’t know about.
You still sound like you are trying to make a decision for them.
I think this is a great thing to see happening. Men are taking birth control into their own hands. Why take the risk of an unwanted pregnancy? Sometimes other methods fail.
The peace of mind must be amazing too
Being trapped by a woman is not even a crime no matter how bad the facts are, including rape.
Society views men as nothing more than ATM in such cases. Should wraped it up twice lol
So good for them!
Better safe than sorry.
Just in case someone out there doesn’t know, never use two condoms. That’s going to cause them to break.
Also, I’m not sure what terrible circumstances happened to you, but I get the feeling you wouldn’t appreciate sweeping statements being made about men like that.
I hope you find yourself in a place where you no longer feel that way.
Say what?
I’ve decided I don’t want to have kids at all.
My wife is taking it better than my son and daughter are.
- No right to abortion in the United States
- Giving someone who didn’t get asked or consent to being born, the forced existence of life.
- A child for a parent is expensive, mentally draining, and you have to be a good parent
- You also have to be the parent for a child with any special needs, from allergies to mental issues to being born without limbs
- If the child is any form of “other” to society, they will be picked on, and then possible harmed by the rise of Neo-Fascism
- Work or starve, work or be cold, work until you die. Another tax number, another corporate slave.
Being born is fine, once you’re here you should try to live life to its fullest. But I don’t want kids, I would be a horrid father.
Let’s not forget about child care, cause you know, in this economy both parents typically need to work to keep their heads financially above water.
Giving someone who didn’t get asked or consent to being born, the forced existence of life.
I’ve never understood that argument. Simple logic states nobody would exist if we asked every sperm and egg before having sex.
Correct, you can’t ask. It’s a question of ethics.
It’s something to just ask. No one was asked to be born. Some where cheated out of a good life. There’s people born into poverty and disease who don’t know a good life. They feel that pain and suffering without the option to go out that isn’t killing themselves.
You weren’t asked, I wasn’t, our parents weren’t, and so on. It’s not evil, it’s just the pure simple fact of “No one was asked to be born into a world where you need to earn money or you will die.”
I still don’t understand.
I’m good with making life less shitty for everyone though.
This is one of those philosophical questions that have no “correct” answer but heres my take on it. Also sorry, this turned into an essay but I was on a roll
The main thing is that having a child isn’t something the parents do for the child. You can’t do anything for a child that doesn’t exist. Having a child is something parents do for themselves; they want a child so they have a child. Plus an unborn child can’t possibly consent to being born. Put those two things together and you have two people doing something that they want to do for their own benefit which fundamentally changes the state of being of another person who can’t possibly consent to it.
When you have a child you are also taking a gamble on how their life will turn out without consulting them. They could wind up being the happiest person in the world who lives a full perfectly fulfilled life. Or they could wind up absolutely miserable for the rest of their life wishing that they have never been born. Both of those things are largely up to random chance.
For example my brother in law was born to a homeless single heroin addict and grew up on the street even after his mom died. He is now a professional engineer with a doting wife, a loving family, and a large house with a white picket fence in a fairly nice neighborhood. He now literally lives the steriotypical american dream except he has a cat instead of a dog. Sure he worked for all of that but even he will tell you that it also just required a lot of luck. Meanwhile my foster brother was born to a happy, healthy, loving, and even relatively wealthy family but due to a freak illness when he was barely a toddler he now has next to no motor function. He can only slightly move one eye and eyelid but even that is taxing for him. He can kind of control a tablet with eye tracking for brief periods of time before it exhausts him and he likes to wink at people to say “hi” but that is the extent of agency he has in the world. He will almost certainly be like that for the rest of his life.
When you have a child you are taking that chance without consulting them. Some people see the chance of their child living a good life as being worth the risk, which is a perfectly acceptable opinion to have. Don’t take this as me saying people need to be ashamed of having children. Like I said, there is no correct answer here. Other people (myself included) see it as unethical to take that risk for someone who can’t consent to it. I obviously lean that way due to personal experience. I also don’t see much point in creating more children when there is even one child that doesn’t have a happy home. My genes aren’t anything special, why make a new child when I could even possibly help an existing child have a better life.
Giving someone who didn’t get asked or consent to being born
How do you signal a desire to be born, practically speaking? Who do you contact to indicate your desire to begin existing?
If you don’t want to exist, why not simply surrender your place in line to someone who does?
I would argue that the hardest working sperm fertilizes the egg, so technically it IS the one who wanted it the most.
Legally speaking, and ethically too, I suppose, parents typically consent for their underage children. They make decisions based on what the parent thinks is in the best interest of their offspring. For some children, their best interest is to never exist. Forced birth is taking medical decisions away from the mother for both the mother and the potential child.
Underpants, you’re pretty smart and I almost always agree with you, but there’s no option for refusing to be born. There’s only one option to stop living willingly, and it’s called suicide.
there’s no option for refusing to be born
There’s no option for volunteering to be born, either. The argument can just as easily be turn on its head.
The idea is anti-natalism is one you develop as a mature rational adult, not one you held prior to your birth.
Think of it as being in a roller coaster. Two minutes into the ride you decide “Too scary, I don’t want to be here” but also acknowledge how it is impractical to get out of your seat in the middle of a loop de loop. So you turn to your friend in the other seat and say “Past me didn’t get consent from future me to be here! That’s unfair!”
You’re asking for something nobody can provide you, even if they wanted to indulge your demands.
Antinatalists aren’t suicidal, most likely living, they just understand that life isn’t a gift.
The “I didn’t ask to be born” argument implies a mechanism by which you could ask to be born.
Go down to your local NICU and survey it’s residents. Tell me how many you meet who hold this view in the hours and days after their birth.
Hell, give me a survey of two year olds. Four year olds. Eight year olds, even.
I challenge you to find me any fervent anti-natalist younger than a teenager. I’ll challenge you to find any that aren’t terminally online.
Anti-natalism isn’t a philosophy you’re born into, it’s something you develop over time through rational observation and logical reason. These are two skills you develop after being alive for some time, typically through dialogue with other living people.
They are not conclusions you can instinctively reach in uterus.
I challenge you to find me any fervent anti-natalist younger than a teenager. I’ll challenge you to find any that aren’t terminally online.
“I challenge you to find anything [you belief in] that isn’t someone I can disregard and not think about.”
Anti-natalism isn’t a philosophy you’re born into, it’s something you develop over time through rational observation and logical reason.
Right, neither is socialism, liberalism, capitalism, nihilism, natalism, or any belief system. You only do what your parents told you to do until you start to have your own thoughts and feelings .
It’s not a literal “Ask the fetus if it wants to live”, it’s more a “The fact we can’t have informed proper consent is odd.” It’s not a “Haha, gotcha! You should kill yourself!”
It’s more the question of “Since we can’t ask, is it ethically correct?” And just doing what nature wants us to do is not always the best.
Not even going in the “muh overpopulation, kill all da browns!!” reactionary way, humans are evolutionary made to be hunter-gatherers, not make books, computers, medicine, money, or anything else we do as the species in 2024 and onwards. Apes don’t know how to make an atomic bomb, humans do. Birds don’t know how to construct the most deeply beautiful sonnets that make every listener weep in awe every time, humans do.
Humans are more than what we were evolved to do. We question everything, including ourselves. Sometimes the fact a question can’t be answered, let alone even properly asked, is a quandary.
This is not a personal “Underpants, you need to prohibit yourself from having a kid”, I can’t control that for anyone but myself. I’m never going to tell a parent or someone wanting to be one that they are a selfish monster, despite what one of my parents was.
You weren’t asked to be born, but you must continue it once you are. The only other choice is willful harm to yourself. If I went to a maternity ward and started smashing in skulls, I’m not an anti-natalist, I’m a murderer. It’s the same reason why abortion isn’t murder.
Right, neither is socialism, liberalism, capitalism, nihilism, natalism, or any belief system.
So why would you assert an unborn person holds these beliefs?
it’s more a “The fact we can’t have informed proper consent is odd.” It’s not a “Haha, gotcha! You should kill yourself!”
Why would you consider communicating with a non-existent entity the basis for making ethical decisions?
It’s not some big gotcha: it’s unethical because consent is impossible to achieve. You have to have been alive for quite a number of years before you even have the cognition and experience to form an opinion about existing.
But that doesn’t just mean creating new beings is good because it’s impossible to consent. How would that apply to anything else?? By some logic (if you ignore obvious pain signals) animals can’t “tell” us they don’t consent to being butchered and eaten but that doesn’t make eating meat ethical either (I’m not vegan btw.) Having sex with an unconscious person is rape, because they can’t consent.
There may be suicidal animals who want to be eaten and there are certainly people who enjoy non-consensual sex and people who like being alive and believe their existence is a gift. The outcome still doesn’t excuse the act in these cases.
it’s unethical because consent is impossible to achieve.
That doesn’t logically follow. Ethics isn’t predicated on a universal consensus.
But that doesn’t just mean creating new beings is good because it’s impossible to consent.
There are a host of arguments for and against childbirth in the modern era. Much as there are a host of arguments for and against industrial mining or nuclear power or second hand smoking. But “the non-existent entity can’t signal consent” isn’t a material consideration, its a theological one. You’re assuming an entity capable of consent that isn’t available to converse with.
It’s also totally unprovable. How do you show pre-born people didn’t consent. If we’re going into the idea of unborn souls being dragged out of the ether into mortal bodies, what means to have to prove they weren’t volunteering to be here?
There may be suicidal animals who want to be eaten and there are certainly people who enjoy non-consensual sex and people who like being alive and believe their existence is a gift.
How do you take a breath without asking permission from everyone around you by infringing on their supply oxygen? How do you take a shit without first verifying everyone in your neighborhood approves of the turd you’re adding to their groundwater?
So much of this really does boil down to “My only ethical move is to kill myself”. Like, you’re deliberately backing yourself into this corner, and then complaining that someone else hasn’t relieved you of the burden of pulling the trigger. It isn’t ethical, its infantile. You are, in effect, bemoaning the fact that every aspect of existence isn’t shaped to your personal beliefs.
Ah yes, the classic “just kill yourself” argument. You totally destroyed that antinatalist.
you don’t, which is why reproducing is inherently unethical.
Why would I force another human into this shitty existence?
Also condoms suck and raw dick is just better.
yea same. condoms suck.
Syphilis and gonorrhea must love you.
If you’re going to mention STDs to scare people, go with the untreatable ones. The two you mentioned require an antibiotic and abstaining from sex for a bit. Love is fleeting, but Herpes is forever.
Wow, I didn’t know it was impossible not to stick your dick in every passing stranger. Here I was only having sex with people I know and who have been tested like a weirdo.
ikr Here I am married 23 years and no STD’s from sex. I think HellsBelle comment quite strange but I suppose if you live in the kind of world they seem to be living in then it could be an issue. Do they know that casual sexual intercourse with random people carries an amount of risk even with the protection?
As someone who’s had a vasectomy: it’s very hard to not stick my dick in a total stranger. That MTV advert with the skates is a more than daily occurrence, and I don’t even skate. Luckily, due to my vasectomy, there are no babies.
Only six STDs so far, so could be worse.
Those are rookie numbers. You gotta pump those up. See if you can catch a shiny syphilis.
Edit: I will now be refering to all antibiotic resistant diseases as shiny diseases. Nobody can stop me.
Ducks are dirty rapists
Kind of slut shamie don’t you think?
Well do you ask your partners if they have STDs?
When animals are over stressed, unable to provide the basics of survival, and constantly dealing with external threats they tend to not have babies.
For real? I didn’t know that.
TYL! 🌈🌟
Can anyone here who’s gotten one comment on the vasectomy process? I’ve been pretty nervous seeing a lot of the comments about it. I don’t even do well with a normal blood draw. I feel like I’d need general anesthesia for this.
Mine was pretty bad. The doctor was really stingy about pain meds. I was miserable the whole procedure and two weeks afterwards.
If I ever get a scheduled surgery again, I’m going to buy gray market pain meds ahead of time.
~For search engines: Alexander Gershman Los Angeles~
I’ve never had kids. Got it done down in TX. Told the doc I’ve never wanted them and didn’t want to pay for anymore abortions.
I did it fully conscious with local anesthesia because I had no one to pick me up and look after me if I took the knockout gas. There were a couple tiny pricks of pain next to the base of my penis, then numbness. An unpleasant tugging sensation in each testicle when he positioned my vas deferens to cut, cauterize, and clamp the ends. That was the worst part, but like I say, it didn’t hurt. Aside from that, I nervously wisecracked with the nurses, who politely laughed and joked back. Then I put my pants back on, paid the bill (ouch!), drove myself home, and spent the weekend getting high and playing video games with frozen gel packs under my balls. All that felt like was the dull tenderness you get a little while after a blow to the junk. Totally manageable. I took some Advil or something.
Against advice, I returned to my strenuous job 3 or 4 days afterwards, and jerked off repeatedly much sooner than suggested. I’ve experienced zero complications, but ymmv. Taking my wisdom teeth out was much worse. Getting a tattoo is far more painful. It was a bit worse than getting my ears pierced, but healed faster.
8/10 Would totally repeat the experience just for the days off with zero responsibilities. My only regret is I didn’t do it at 18.
Mine was almost painless.
I took, paracetamol only after ward for a day. I was walking around with no issues after the local anesthetic wore off.
My brother had a really shit time, severe swelling and major pain for a week.
I think skill plays a big factor!
Go for a doctor that has a great reputation, ask people that they have done the procedure on!!!
For me the procedure was not bad at all, local anesthetic was enough. When it was done. I thought everything had gone smoothly. But I would say, pay attention to the possible after effects. Apparently somewhere less than 1% of people have pain that never goes away. I ended up having pain for a solid year. And still on a rare occasion even today, 14 years later my nuts will still ache. At least it’s rare that it happens, but if I had to go back I don’t know if I would have done it again. I also find ejaculation less satisfying than I used to. It’s like lifelong blue balls. I’m not trying to talk you out of it. The risks for women having their version of the surgery is far worse.
Was really nbd. Gave me a local. Felt no pain at the time. Spent the next day in bed with ice on it. A little soreness, cleared up quickly. Way better than a kidneystone, fwiw.
Way better than a kidneystone, fwiw.
I would hope so considering many people, including women who have given birth, describe kidney stones as the worst pain they’ve ever felt lol.
Whole thing lasts no more than 15-20 minutes. I took it easy for a few days but otherwise no issues. Was riding my bike and all that about five days after.
The only uncomfortable bit is when they put the anaesthetic… there’s no easy way of saying this, but they have to stick the needle in both of the sperm ducts. That’s a little uncomfortable but it lasts no more than 5 seconds per nut. From there on out no issues. You feel some stuff moving around down there, but no pain.
I had the scalpel free method, fwiw.
My clinic sent me this video to prep. It’s quite useful. https://youtu.be/gzpYhe8QBsA
My doc did it under local. His preference. After, there was a little discomfort but no real pain. Like that sensation after you’ve been kicked in the nuts but the pain has gone away. Kinda feels like a stone in your taint. Lasted a few days and I was off doing stuff for about a week. It wasn’t terrible. Should have done it earlier honestly.
There was an initial consultation, where the doctor told me that quite a few childless men want to get the procedure reversed later, but you should consider it “not reversible.” Not a problem for me.
On the day I entered a very small room with a reclined chair. The lights were dimmed. The only pain was a brief “pinch” during anesthesia. This was “needleless” anesthesia with some kind of aerosol device, but a needle probably would have been about the same. Needles don’t bother me, so I considered this a gimmick.
It was done a lot faster than I thought. I was chatting with the urologist the entire time. The stitches were in a different part of my scrotum than I imagined they would be (higher up). Initial recovery was fine, but a couple weeks later I did have some post-op pain that was pretty bad. NSAIDS, suprisingly, helped quite a bit. This recurred a few times a year for about five years and then never again. It was not an infection. From what I understand this is a rare side effect, but possible. For a lot of people it’s totally painless, but that was my experience.
My doctor did a very good job. I barely felt anything after the freezing (he used a topical before injecting the actual dose), and he did the whole procedure quickly and efficiently.
Sent me home with a big bottle of pain killers, but I barely needed any of them.
My brother, on the other hand, was in pain for almost a week after his.
Find a well regarded doctor and you should have a better time.
Mine was painful, I felt too much. The needle in each ball was a mule kick. Ive got that fancy genetic resistance to numbing agents. So other than the external lidocaine, I felt A LOT of what the guy was doing.
I get to blow my wife without second thought now though…so worth it for sure.
I am squeamish as all hell. Didn’t think I could do it. There’s a consult. They give you a Xanax, I’d recomme r telling them you’re a heavyweight and get a driver, also recommend to pay the extra 100 bucks for the laughing gas.
It’s over fast. There’s minimal pain. I ordered a jock strap and used it to hold ice packs over my underwear. It’s uncomfortable but I just layed up all weekend. Overall what I got out of it is completely worth it.
I’ll answer any questions you have
What did you got?
A vasectomy.
Edit: sorry I get it now. I got peace of mind knowing that I was in control of contraception. Not having children means a lot of freedom. So basically freedom and peace of mind.
They use a small hole punch device after a spray anesthetic on the area to make a pinhole size hole. They pull the vas through and cut it before sheathing the vas so sperm can’t get through then do the same with the second vas.
I had a small amount of pain with the second one but they applied more spray. It is kinda my own fault for not telling them ahead of time that I process all anesthetic drugs fast. I don’t know why but I always require refreezing at the dentist for regular procedures.
https://www.pollockclinics.com/no-scalpel-vasectomy/our-approach/
It was relatively fast and painless. I had someone drive me home, wore athletic protection for a few days, laid off of any sort of rigorous exercise, and its been a really straightforward recovery experience after that. No ragrets.
I had a bad time with mine. They wouldn’t give me anything beyond some local anesthetic. I could definitely feel tugging sensations as they did it, and I passed out and almost fell of the table afterwords. (Luckily my wife caught me as the nurse and Dr had already left the room)
Not bad painwise, but mine experience was not a walk in the park like I see other people have.
I needed more medication to numb than he thought–way more. Don’t be afraid to speak up. Otherwise, the process was easy. I had discomfort for longer than he said, but that’s just how my body is. Two years later, I still have some discomfort doing certain things (not common things), but again that’s how my body is. That is how it is for some people, and I am just one of those few unlucky people. I have the ability to sense painful things greater than most and the ability to tolerate that pain more than most. It was still worth it. My wife and I were done having children and now we don’t have to worry about any surprises.
Fairly fast, fairly simple. I arranged a friend to drive me and I was content the inconvenience fell under what I would ask of a friend. Got a local anaesthetic, the doctor and nurse talked about mundanities the entire time, which was comforting in a way. But I could see “why aren’t you focused right now” being a valid question.
Recovery was pretty speedy, but I knew I was going to be on strong pain killers due to a surgery and timed my procedure for that.
Lasting effects, other than sterility and slight scaring, is that pulling my balls hurts much more than it used to. The ‘suck on the balls’ move in the vids would have me doubled over, they do not want to be tugged any amount, for any reason. For a time I got a periodic sharp pain in my sack that has long since gone.
All in all I’m happy I did it, would do it again. Would probably endure more for the benefits.
As to the article I count in this number. Knew I didn’t want kids before my 18th and starting nagging the gp to establish a pattern. I had life changing injury at 26 due to a dangerous hobby, asked again and was referred then accepted. I don’t want kids because I’m lazy, and I will orphan them young.
Only thing I felt was the shot to numb me before they cut. Some tenderness afterward but all in all I’ve had worse pain stubbing my toe.
This is what happens when the conservatives threaten the right to an abortion. Drastic measures have to be taken.
No kid should be born unloved or a woman have her life threatened because too many ignorant folks think she is sinful for getting healthcare or evil for not raising more wage slaves for the bourgeoisie.
I disagree but unless we get actual data on why people are choosing not to have kids then we don’t really know for sure.
I’d say the major reason is wealth inequality, cost of living, inflation, housing prices, etc. Everything’s too expensive… everything. It’s getting to the point that life isn’t even worth living anymore, as its just a repetitive cycle to work and pay bills. I both can’t afford to have a kid, nor would I want to bring one into this hellscape.
Again no way to know the real reasons unless we get the data.
It’s money first and foremost. People are struggling to survive by themselves. They can’t afford kids. So conservatives get rid of abortion. They frame it as a religious issue, but it’s only such for their ignorant followers. For those monied individuals at the top its purely about having an ever growing slave caste to exploit. Can’t have infinitely growing profits without an infinitely growing base of suckers to sell shit to.
It’s also about freedom. Self determination. And the general state of the world. Nothing of substance is being done about climate change. We’re staring down the barrel of WWIII. Late Stage capitalism.
It’s a confluence of factors that taken together paint a particularly bleak future.
Im planning on getting one soon, and it’s definitely this for me.
Also I tend to believe climate scientists who say shit is going to get interesting within the next 20 years… not really something I’d feel good about bringing a kid into.
One data point and I’m American, but figured I’d give my two cents on why I did it.
In addition to all the reasons you listed I think that my own mental health is an obstacle, and also the increasingly limited access to women’s healthcare.
Making the decision to not have kids was a complex issue for me as I imagine it is for others too. Tbh the political and economic climate was probably the final push I needed, but there’s probably at least 10 reasons in total.
Did Canada ban abortion ?
All the conservative mps have voted against support of abortions recently and they’re currently projected to a win a majority government in the future.
WTF
Conservatives around the world all have the same base set of goals, and subjugating women is one of the cornerstones.
Let’s get clear i hate pp and the con as much a everybody here but pp never ever talked about removing abortion rights, he actually said the opposite. I’ll reiterate pp is a loser, he has no real agenda, and his whole camapign is basically fuck trudeau. But he never said abortions right were on the table.
A common sense Conservative government will not legislate on abortion and therefore would never use this section of the Constitution pertaining to this matter," he said.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/poilievre-same-sex-marriage-abortion-1.7222881
In an interview with Liberal MP Nathaniel Erskine-Smith, who hosts a podcast called Uncommons, Alberta Conservative MP Arnold Viersen also stressed his social conservative credentials on other issues, saying he wants protections for what he calls the “pre-born,” supports Alberta Premier Danielle Smith’s transgender policies and would vote to criminalize cannabis possession again if given the opportunity.
Asked by Erskine-Smith about a hypothetical future bill to overturn same-sex marriage, Viersen said, “I vote gay marriage down.”
In a media statement issued Monday, Poilievre said Viersen’s statements and positions “do not represent the positions of the Conservative Party, or myself as leader.”
“As our party’s policy book, adopted by party members, has said for years, ‘a Conservative Government will not support any legislation to regulate abortion.’ When I am prime minister, no laws or rules will be passed that restrict women’s reproductive choices. Period,” Poilievre added
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/rayes-abortion-poilievre-1.7362640
Poilievre has said that if he’s elected prime minister, his government will not support any legislation to regulate abortion.
“As the Party’s policy book, adopted by Party members, has said for years, ‘a Conservative Government will not support any legislation to regulate abortion,’” said Poilievre’s spokesperson, Sebastian Skamski, in a media statement.
“When Canadians elect Pierre Poilievre as Prime Minister, no laws or rules will be passed that restrict women’s reproductive choices. Period.”
Once again just to be clear. Fuck pp and his cons🫡
Yes, but also conservatives are frequently lying bastards who promise to not make things worse and then make things worse. The US supreme court judges aren’t Canadian, but they are conservatives and the recently appointed ones all said that Roe v Wade was settled law and they wouldn’t change it,.
Oh yeah totally, i don’t trust them at all. rich people are pieces of shit and those that cater to them are shit eater.
Here’s another interesring one. Even tough it’s already 2 years old.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/abortion-rights-canada-morgentaler-court-1.6439612
Personally as a french canadian i have the easy way of voting bloc. I might vote for the npd again, but i don’t see Jagmeet ever being able to get over the xenophobia… so yah alot of fun time on the way~🫠
Continue not taxing the rich and making conditions worse for the 99%. Let’s see how it works out.
The rich don’t care. They only want people to have kids insofar as to depress the value of labor relative to assets. Once the automation of lower skill services are complete, they will happily give every poor as many vasectomies and abortions they want.
Exactly
This is what happens when you can’t afford raising kids and also more and more people decide that they would rather just enjoy their life without the responsibility or or financial burden of raising kids. I don’t know how i feel about this due to the our birth rate not doing so well, and instead of people having children, we have to import people into the country (which i have no problem with but that really isn’t a solution).
that really isn’t a solution
why not? are you afraid of johnny whitebread “real”
muricancanadian getting…replaced?the fact that the 1% is shitting their pants over the declining birthrate makes me think it’s fan fucking tastic. every industry’s profit margin suffers from fewer babies. less money is spent on food, gas, clothes, giant SUVs, toys, medicine–literally everything you buy for yourself, you’re also buying for your kids for 18 years. unless you don’t have kids.
those poor, poor shareholders.
fuck them. low birthrate = GOOD.
also, please–who wants to have a kid just so they can explain to them why they’re growing up in a toxic wasteland?
why not? are you afraid of johnny whitebread “real” murican canadian getting…replaced?
It’s not a solution because, with a few exceptions, standards of living (and therefore reasons to not immigrate) are rising in most of the world, so in a few decades there likely won’t be enough migrants to go around.
those poor, poor shareholders.
If it looks like only shareholders are having problems because of low birthrates in Japan and South Korea, then you should learn more about those places.
Bruh there’s 8 billion people on the planet. We don’t need more. We won’t be running out of migrants any time soon.
There’s 8 billion sure, but migrants only exist because of the power imbalance between the Western hegemony and everyone else. As standards of living improve globally, people become less willing to migrate as they’re able to pursue a sustainable future in their home country.
Thankfully, climate change will cause widespread disaster and ruin areas once habitable, which should allow for a healthy baseline of migration, and the West can always destabilize a few more countries if they really need more cheap labor.
But you’re forgetting the key rule of capitalism. Line must always go up forever. That means population must always go up to make more workers and consumers. Birthrates are dropping pretty much across the board. The earth is currently projected to hit it’s peak population around 2086. Developing countries eventually become industrialized nations. Eventually there will be fewer reasons to emigrate from those countries. Both of those things combined will lead to fewer available migrant workers in “first world” countries.
Sure, this isn’t likely to be an issue any time soon but within a generation or two it will start to become an issue. When you’re running a country then you really should be planning for the future like that.
Of course the correct fix for that issue isn’t to force people to have more children; it’s to fix capitalism so that infinite growth isn’t a central element. But fixing capitalism would mean billionares wouldn’t be able to afford to buy every politician so the politicians won’t let that happen.
Don’t worry climate change will ensure we never run out of migrants.
However, climate change may also mean that we hit the population cap sooner.
Pretty sure we hit that awhile ago.
i’m not sure why you brought race into this, when there is multiple multigenerional multicultural people in this country. I don’t think its a requirement that everyone has to have a child, but the way you are talking makes it sound like its a good thing our species wipes itself out. I get how you feel about CEOs and stuff, but i was just stating that why our birthrate was low, and what the goverment has done to fix that.
makes it sound like its a good thing our species wipes itself out
not necessarily a good thing, but we are indeed wiping ourselves out, for better or worse. sure, future generations might fix all the multitudes of problems we’ve caused (doubt), but how many will have to die in the process?
evangelists love to call people who don’t want kids “selfish.” on the contrary, it’s the polar opposite of selfish to deny our own reptilian brain instincts to pass on our genes because we don’t think it’s a moral decision to bring innocent children to life in this soon-to-be-uninhabitable broken hellscape
I think we cannot give up and say that this is it.
guess you better start having more kids then
I don’t want to. Can’t afford it
I’m sorry, there is an international chat group where a bunch of doctors that perform vasectomies congregate and talk about vasectomies?
Gotta share the best practices, its like the postmarket os matrix chat where tech enthusiasts support each other improving builds ;)
Too specific analogy.
lol all about that postmarket
I mean, yeah, why not? There are international whatevers for almost anything, specially professional practices. It’s less cumbersome and cheaper than relying on regulatory bodies to organize and run conventions or seminars. Most of these chats are informal and born from that kind of events as well.
Something I also learned from working with the health sector is that there are really very few 100% dedicated to their niche specialists in every area. Sure, there are many heart surgeons, but very few experts on ventricular septal defect surgery on children. And some of that stuff can be so complex as to be a sole area of dedicated study. It allows these kind of informal forums and encourages a strong mentor-apprentice dynamics. So it is not rare they hit the group chat every once in a while. I also learned there are over a dozen different ways to make a vasectomy procedure and some doctors know how to do a few but not all of them and there are reasons to prefer some over the others depending on the patient.
Welcome to the Internet - you’re new here, I take it?
Is that weird? I’m in HVAC and I talk with fellow HVAC people all over the world. This is a thing with most fields. It doesn’t seem at all weird that there would be groups of urologists online.
People join chatrooms to talk about their favorite TV shows or their jobs. This is no different.
Probably. I can imagine doctors being like “Hey y’all check out my favorite vasectomizin’ wrench. You should get one of these, it’s a true 0 degree, tightens down them nuts in hard to reach spaces.”
Vasectomies without Borders
I’m imagining a lads’ group where they post the gnarliest botched vasectomies
Probably slightly more generalized like a urologist chat.
No kids, never wanted them, made sure I never have them. Happily married for 8 years, she never wants kids either.
so you guys are DINKs
Correct! We like to travel~ I make sure to send all my nieces/nephews birthday cards and nice Christmas presents
cool.
Could be NONKs, lol
Edit: NINKs
Whats the O?
Oncome
whats oncome?
Not much, what’s on with you?
Here’s the thing about abortion in Canada …
- the right to abortion is not codified in law: the SCoC struck down the laws against abortion in 1988 based on our 1982 Charter of Rights
- abortion is technically legal under the federal Health Act
- this is why the Cons have stated they don’t want to challenge women’s ability to have an abortion … because if they did in court, and it went to SCoC, the court could (and likely would) force the Con gov’t to enact actual legislation forever enshrining abortion rights in Canadian law
- the Cons, just like the GOP down south, are hoping to have enough power at some time to force change here – but the problem is our SCoC works differently than SCOTUS (ie: zero judges are elected in Canada, ever); SCoC rulings are not based on original intent (and our Charter is vastly newer than America’s founding documents); etc.
I’m doing my part.
But seriously, men should be more responsible when it comes to birth control and not leave it up to women, so I think this is a good thing.
men should be more responsible when it comes to birth control and not leave it up to women
Men literally only have 2 options: condom or vasectomy. Condoms don’t feel good for either side, which is why both try to avoid using them. Vasectomies can be reversible, but require surgery and thus are costly, which of course makes it impossible or at the very least much less attractive for a large portion of society.
Yes, men can buy underwear that heats up their balls to temperatures that kill sperm, but I’d like you to go around spreading the word of discomfort through sweaty balls and see how far you get.
You know what feels way worse than condoms but is just as effective? Celibacy. Don’t complain about how the sex you’re having isn’t good enough, say that the risks to your partner aren’t important enough, or tell them that they’re the only one that needs to be responsible. I can’t imagine the type of person that would still sleep with you with those attitudes. (If you feel like fluid bonding with a person, great, that’s your choice, but some of us don’t want to, have multiple partners, or can’t)
Your 3rd option is chemical castration, which is kind of like taking the pill for decades.
Chemical castration is not birth control. Firstly, it rarely actually results in complete sterility. Secondly, it’s whole purpose is to remove sex drive and the ability to feel arousal. Chemical castration in men is closer to women taking an estrogen blocker than it is to hormonal birth control.
I guess if you consider abstinence to be birth control then you could call it birth control because it enforces abstinence. But ultimately the issue is just that sperm production is far less dependent on hormones than eggs being released. Hormonal changes in men can can easily result in a large reduction in fertility but it is very difficult to cause complete infertility short of physical means. Even trans women who are several years into hormone therapy (without srs obviously) can remain fertile.
That’s not really an option comparable to taking the pill. Firstly, it isn’t meant to sterilize, it works by effectively removing a person’s ability to become aroused. It also comes with a ton of side effects like reduced testosterone, osteoporosis, suicidal thoughts, etc.
At least with a condom, a guy can still have sex.
The pill gives women multiple side effects that can be debilitating yet men still prefer the woman take care of birth control.
Granted, but generally women are still able to have sex on the pill. Chemical castration removes that ability entirely, on top of the side effects.
Presenting that in a thread discussing men undergoing voluntary surgery to sterilize themselves while stating that men make women handle birth control is a bit of a hot take there.
Men prefer women to do it because women are the only ones with non-permanent options that are 99.x% effective.
Fact is, only the female body has a built-in ‘mode’ that naturally shuts off fertility, that pharmaceuticals can ‘trick’ the body into activating, making creating effective contraception for females extremely easy compared to the difficulty level for males.
There is no one to blame for these biological facts of the matter. They are as they are, all we can do is work with what we’ve got.
There’s another wrinkle: pregnancy is a health risk for females, and is the consequence for unprotected sex for them. Males have no equivalent thing that happens to their body as a result of unprotected sex. Contraception needs to be at least as safe as the alternative to be viable. Therefore, female contraceptives need only to be less risky than pregnancy to be viable, while male contraceptives need to be less risky than doing nothing, to be equivalently viable.
Again, this is not anyone’s fault. That’s just how it is.
Yeah, I can already hear the hordes dashing to the urologist for that.
