Corruption is entirely linked to power. To believe that one system of government is better able to manage corruption than another is exceptionalism.
My point about getting rid of money is not a slogan, it is a key property of a society that has matured beyond such exemplars of poverty.
Until society is able to operate without hierarchical overachieving leadership, corruption will never stop. To believe that the primary leaders anywhere are not perpetuating their continued control and power is naive, and indicates some ignorance of what humans are and why they behave as they do.
Also, I’m calling big chunks of your response AI gen’d, which suggests a wish to win an argument rather than comprehend reality.
Not at all. I have to deal with a lot of AI generated slop, and the first half of your reply had a distinctly AI slop sound to it. That’s why I gave my reply then only mentioned the AI bit at the very end.
I have to deal with a lot of AI generated slop, and the first half of your reply had a distinctly AI slop sound to it.
You should probably stop having chatGPT write your responses for you, because I’m not the same user.
That’s why I gave my reply then only mentioned the AI bit at the very end.
It didn’t seem like it was written by AI at all. You’re just being willfully obstinate because someone disagrees with you and that must mean there’s something wrong with them. Next you’re gonna go crying about russian bots or some similar shit.
Wow bot jacketing me instead of actually contending with anything I have to say. unfortunately not the first time.
Corruption is not caused by “power” in the abstract. It’s produced by class relations and ownership of production. Every class society has authority, the issue is which class controls it. That is until class society is abolished on a global scale, but that’s so far in the future acting like it’s the next step is infantile and ridiculous.
Saying “no system handles corruption better than another” is just blatantly false. Under the Communist Party of China, billionaires and senior officials are regularly investigated, removed, and jailed. In capitalist states, corruption is legalized and encouraged pointing this out isn’t exceptionalism I’m not sure you know what that word means. Is it exceptionalism to say that liberal democracy handles representation of the people better than feudalism? Obviously not that’s ridiculous.
I’ll give the same example again as you skipped over it to bot jacket me. Jack Ma was disciplined for pushing US-style financialization. In the United States, that same behavior is rewarded and institutionalized.
“Get rid of money” without explaining how you suppress bourgeois forces, organize production, and defend society during transition is not a program, it’s a slogan. Repeating this again from earlier: money like the state only withers away after classes are abolished far in the future.
Corruption is a known contradiction of the socialist transition period. It does not delegitimize the socialist project it simply proves continuous class struggle and anti-corruption campaigns are necessary hence their implementation in socialist states under communist parties.
Where you complain about “hierarchy” you’re just doing vague “human-nature” metaphysics. This is idealism and is about as reliable as scripture for analysis.
Look I don’t want to be mean (even if I find you to be unduly arrogant and condescending and I really don’t appreciate the bot jacketing), however these comments reek of Euro-American left liberalism. All vibes no dialectical or historical materialism or really any serious analysis at all.
You effectively do the “human nature” bit which is idealist metaphysics bullshit and you really seem to lack any understanding of any leftist theory.
You really should consider studying scientific socialism and deconstructing your liberal foundations. Vibes are not analysis and that’s all you have for now. If you want I can recommend you some books/articles that can help you but I have a feeling you disagree with my framing of you.
I don’t pretend to know everything about Leftist theory, but it doesn’t seem complicated. Also, I’m from the UK, where things different enough from the US that it is worth mentioning.
I don’t care for any governmental system that exists now. They are all based on state control of individual freedoms. I am essentially an Anarchist, but with “protection from a distance” meaning something automated and trusted that protects people from harm and control by others, while allowing everyone to do as they please. I realise this is a futuristic fantasy but it is worth aiming for imho.
Before I critique communism further I want to make it clear that I know western democracies are corrupt, some extremely so, and that corruption is driven by the super rich. (Oil, tech, arms, other evil shit).
The nature of corruption is very different between western Democracy and communism. In the west it mostly goes public (and not much gets done about it apparently), but changes are made and things do generally improve in the long term. In china it is all done behind closed doors, and is about protecting bureaucracies. For me the "public vs “private” behaviour is the most important difference. When issues are public is there a chance for the public to have a voice, but when it’s all behind closed doors what chance do the public have?
Also, it is about individual freedoms to do and say what you like without fear of state interference, which communist states don’t have a good reputation for. I’m sure you can think of a few subjects you can’t discuss in China. Why is that? What subjects can’t you discuss in the UK?
Granted, right now western culture is going through a period of hyper conservatism with freedoms being oppressed, but this is a battle ground with voices from every corner speaking out, which is impossible in a communist state. How would this be dealt with in China? Either way, I am hopeful this too shall pass, and we’ll move away from the extremes of capitalism (once the current generation of old people die off)
Regarding my idealism around getting rid of money. T
I know this is a problem we can’t solve today, but I don’t think it’s far away This is a side topic for another post I feel. I’ll write up my thoughts and post it.
Corruption is entirely linked to power. To believe that one system of government is better able to manage corruption than another is exceptionalism.
My point about getting rid of money is not a slogan, it is a key property of a society that has matured beyond such exemplars of poverty.
Until society is able to operate without hierarchical overachieving leadership, corruption will never stop. To believe that the primary leaders anywhere are not perpetuating their continued control and power is naive, and indicates some ignorance of what humans are and why they behave as they do.
Also, I’m calling big chunks of your response AI gen’d, which suggests a wish to win an argument rather than comprehend reality.
Everyone who disagrees with me is AI and other arguments for the massively propagandised
Not at all. I have to deal with a lot of AI generated slop, and the first half of your reply had a distinctly AI slop sound to it. That’s why I gave my reply then only mentioned the AI bit at the very end.
You should probably stop having chatGPT write your responses for you, because I’m not the same user.
It didn’t seem like it was written by AI at all. You’re just being willfully obstinate because someone disagrees with you and that must mean there’s something wrong with them. Next you’re gonna go crying about russian bots or some similar shit.
Someone is trying to educate you out of your wild idealism and you’re being an obstinate asshole
Wow bot jacketing me instead of actually contending with anything I have to say. unfortunately not the first time.
Corruption is not caused by “power” in the abstract. It’s produced by class relations and ownership of production. Every class society has authority, the issue is which class controls it. That is until class society is abolished on a global scale, but that’s so far in the future acting like it’s the next step is infantile and ridiculous.
Saying “no system handles corruption better than another” is just blatantly false. Under the Communist Party of China, billionaires and senior officials are regularly investigated, removed, and jailed. In capitalist states, corruption is legalized and encouraged pointing this out isn’t exceptionalism I’m not sure you know what that word means. Is it exceptionalism to say that liberal democracy handles representation of the people better than feudalism? Obviously not that’s ridiculous.
I’ll give the same example again as you skipped over it to bot jacket me. Jack Ma was disciplined for pushing US-style financialization. In the United States, that same behavior is rewarded and institutionalized.
“Get rid of money” without explaining how you suppress bourgeois forces, organize production, and defend society during transition is not a program, it’s a slogan. Repeating this again from earlier: money like the state only withers away after classes are abolished far in the future.
Corruption is a known contradiction of the socialist transition period. It does not delegitimize the socialist project it simply proves continuous class struggle and anti-corruption campaigns are necessary hence their implementation in socialist states under communist parties.
Where you complain about “hierarchy” you’re just doing vague “human-nature” metaphysics. This is idealism and is about as reliable as scripture for analysis.
Look I don’t want to be mean (even if I find you to be unduly arrogant and condescending and I really don’t appreciate the bot jacketing), however these comments reek of Euro-American left liberalism. All vibes no dialectical or historical materialism or really any serious analysis at all.
You effectively do the “human nature” bit which is idealist metaphysics bullshit and you really seem to lack any understanding of any leftist theory.
You really should consider studying scientific socialism and deconstructing your liberal foundations. Vibes are not analysis and that’s all you have for now. If you want I can recommend you some books/articles that can help you but I have a feeling you disagree with my framing of you.
I don’t pretend to know everything about Leftist theory, but it doesn’t seem complicated. Also, I’m from the UK, where things different enough from the US that it is worth mentioning.
I don’t care for any governmental system that exists now. They are all based on state control of individual freedoms. I am essentially an Anarchist, but with “protection from a distance” meaning something automated and trusted that protects people from harm and control by others, while allowing everyone to do as they please. I realise this is a futuristic fantasy but it is worth aiming for imho.
Before I critique communism further I want to make it clear that I know western democracies are corrupt, some extremely so, and that corruption is driven by the super rich. (Oil, tech, arms, other evil shit).
The nature of corruption is very different between western Democracy and communism. In the west it mostly goes public (and not much gets done about it apparently), but changes are made and things do generally improve in the long term. In china it is all done behind closed doors, and is about protecting bureaucracies. For me the "public vs “private” behaviour is the most important difference. When issues are public is there a chance for the public to have a voice, but when it’s all behind closed doors what chance do the public have?
Also, it is about individual freedoms to do and say what you like without fear of state interference, which communist states don’t have a good reputation for. I’m sure you can think of a few subjects you can’t discuss in China. Why is that? What subjects can’t you discuss in the UK?
Granted, right now western culture is going through a period of hyper conservatism with freedoms being oppressed, but this is a battle ground with voices from every corner speaking out, which is impossible in a communist state. How would this be dealt with in China? Either way, I am hopeful this too shall pass, and we’ll move away from the extremes of capitalism (once the current generation of old people die off)
Regarding my idealism around getting rid of money. T I know this is a problem we can’t solve today, but I don’t think it’s far away This is a side topic for another post I feel. I’ll write up my thoughts and post it.