Well, Bashir (and I think his buddies from the Institute?) are proof that it’s possible. I’ve never delved into novels or other things about the Eugenics Wars, though.

Controls’ file says that Georgiou was brought to the prime universe in 2257, ”but after a few years we lost contact.” The events of season two of DIS take place almost immediately after season one, unless there were ”a few years” between the resolution of the Klingon war, and the USS Discovery setting out from Earth to pick up her new captain on Vulcan in “Will You Take My Hand?”.

I wonder if our boi Ash Tyler had something to do with that when he covered up what happened to Discovery (and, I guess, to Leland). Maybe he decided to remove Georgiou from that whole situation and falsify a record saying she disappeared some time later.

I also wonder if Ashy T. is still involved with S31 at this point - the man’s a Klingon, so he’s got the life span for it.

I really think we need another reference point - I wouldn’t say any of the “new” series seem particularly like Star Wars, aesthetically or tonally.

I also don’t think Star Wars should have a monopoly on certain types of storytelling, but that’s neither here nor there.

It’s still on track to close within the next few months.

I have my doubts that the tv side of Trek will be affected too much, but maybe the new management will be able to remove some of the roadblocks on the theatrical side.

This is pretty thoughtful, and I get where you’re coming from.

I do, however, think that the newer shows are frequently aspirational…but the focus has shifted toward doing the right thing in an environment that makes it difficult. There’s a lot more emphasis on struggle, in a way that hasn’t really been explored outside of DS9, and perhaps certain parts of ENT. That works for me, as I think it’s the more salient message for the times we live in: there are always going to be struggles, the greatest dangers often come from within, and doing the right thing can be incredibly hard.

we rarely ever get any breathing room downtime with the characters!

I definitely get this - it’s unfortunately something we’re going to have to learn to live with, because I don’t see longer seasons coming back any time soon (and honestly, they come with their own sets of drawbacks).

She did note that there are legitimate concerns about some parliamentarians potentially having problematic relationships with foreign officials, exercising poor judgment, behaving naively and perhaps displaying questionable ethics.

“But I did not see evidence of parliamentarians conspiring with foreign states against Canada,” the report concludes.

“While some conduct may be concerning, I did not see evidence of ‘traitors’ in Parliament.”

This is encouraging, but there needs to be a mechanism for these “problematic relationships” to be brought out into the public sphere (without it becoming a witch hunt).

The headline has since been changed:

Trudeau to fill Senate vacancies before retiring: source

we didn’t really learn much more about her than we already knew.

Yeah. I said in my original comment that the Georgiou storyline is the strongest one, but it still feels very much like the first chapter that sets up future development, rather than something that pushed her story very far forward. It basically positions her as realizing that maybe a “monster with a conscience” isn’t so useless after all, and that she can work to atone for her past misdeeds.

Which is fine…but it’s still a setup for future stories that may never happen. It very much feels like a series pilot, rather than a standalone movie.

I completely agree with all of the other stuff you mention about the other characters, and I think it just screams, “we tried to compress an entire season’s worth of story into a single movie.” A lot of stuff happens, but everything that would get us invested in the characters was cut.

The Fuzz reveal makes a lot more sense if if happens in, say, episode 7 out of 10.

I would be happy to see these characters again, under a different writer/director team.

I think I liked it more than you did, but there are few criticisms I’ve seen that I don’t agree with. Enjoying it does not necessarily equate with thinking it was good, you know?

I’m hearing that she may have come aboard at Michelle Yeoh’s request.

Who was that hologram lady supposed to be at the end? She looks vaguely familiar but I couldn’t place her.

That was, unexpectedly, the legendary Jamie Lee Curtis.

LOL my guess - and it’s only a guess - is that this is what happens when the previous Emperor either dies or abdicates willingly.

Which would make it maybe the seventh most ridiculous thing about the Terran Empire.

Okay, I enjoyed it as a breezy action movie.

I had a goofy grin on my face for much of the first act - it had style, which sort of fell away over time, which was unfortunate.

The Georgiou story is by far the strongest aspect of the movie - long-lost lover seeking revenge isn’t the most original of plots, but it’s executed well enough, and Michelle Yeoh is pretty terrific as expected. I particularly liked her line about a monster with a conscience being useless.

The middle act probably should have been simplified. The mole storyline was a distraction that prevented us from getting to know the new characters, and every single one of them suffers for it. Garrett’s storyline needed more meat, and I would have appreciated more time spent with Alok beyond just the exposition of his backstory. Quasi skates by on Sam Richardson’s considerable charm alone.

All in all, I think the movie is worth the time, even if no one’s going to call it “deep” any time soon. I’d certainly be interested in watching them go to Turkana IV.

RIP Zeph. You were too beautiful for this world.

I appreciate the long answer - this is supposed to be a space for discussion!

I appreciate your perspective, too - I think if there’s a difference in our perspectives, it might be that I prefer to see aspiration through struggle. The TNG “sunny ways” were fine for its time, but I think it’s more meaningful - especially in the times we’re living through - to portray the eternal vigilance and struggle to get to the Federation “utopia” (I kind of hate that word, but you know what I mean) - and to maintain it once you’ve got it.

It’s interesting - I guess in my mind, the stuff SNW is doing is about as close to “traditional” Star Trek as it’s possible to get in the current landscape. What do you feel is missing?

I haven’t liked everything to come out of this era, but on balance I think Kurtzman has done a very good job with the franchise. One streaming movie that’s a bit of a dud (assuming I don’t like it when I actually see it) isn’t likely to change my opinion on that.

The Verge: Star Trek: Section 31 is firing on all cylinders

Go on…

To be honest, that’s always been the core argument.

I don’t know where the line is - obviously, the morphogenic virus in DS9 was beyond the pale, but is it wise to expect hostile neighbours to be won over by sunshine and rainbows?