Palestine action? Never heard of them. We support Action for Palestinian.
The People’s Front of Judea?
No, The Judean People’s Front.
- The people’s front of Palestine AKA the Palestinians people’s front AKA… The name changes will cease when the facists stop being facist
I mean ok but the drafters of the Terrorism Act did think of that already, changing your name doesn’t get you out of anything. Both the IRA and National Front were forever peeling off into splinter groups with new names back in the 20th century.
How does that even work then, do they just decide what group you are supporting?
Pretty much, I mean that’s why we have judges, to look at all the facts of the case and make a decision on whether this is functionally the same group of people doing the same things as they were under another name. Legal loopholes aren’t as easy as some people think.
The movie references the splintering of the PFLP (Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine).
- 1967 Palestinian Popular Struggle Front (PPSF)
- 1968 Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine – General Command (PFLP-GC)
- 1969 Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine (DFLP)
- 1972 Popular Revolutionary Front for the Liberation of Palestine
Splitters
Fuck you, government. I do not respect your existence, and day by day, am losing respect for the laws you demand we follow. Fuck your rules.
I mean, I get it. Anarchy looks so great sometimes. But I like roads and schools and hospitals and firemen; and we need to.elect someone who ensure those persist.
And then it’s down to choosing the least-worst bunch to do that. And that’s how it’s been for decades.
So, ask yourself: is changing out this regime and losing a bit of healthcare and a bit of infrastructure and a bit of other things that make life livable here, is that a reasonable exchange?
If you say yes, I respect you. If you say no, I respect you. But we can’t vote single-issue: we have a choice between leadership packages, and we need to evaluate them as a whole. The yanks lost their election by voting single-issue, and ended up allowing the worst choice ever to win.
So vote carefully.
‘I’ll vote for people who support genocide if they will pass a little bit less publicly owned infrastructure into the hands of private capital’ is a pathetic position to take.
It absolutely is not worthy of respect.
Your take is so weak. The “yanks” lost the election because of disinformation campaigns and low information voters. By placating fascist political action, all you are is delaying the inevitable decline of civilization. You’re a frog sitting in a warming pot complimenting the relaxing pond.
The Democrats lost because they fucked up and lost sight of the average person as they disappeared up their own arses.
If the Dems don’t take accountability for their own failings it will continue to happen
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The dichotomy of anarchy and voting is confusing. Anarchy in context probably means lawlessness. Defining anarchy as lawlessness ignores anarchy as a political philosophy.
Roads, schools, hospitals and fire departments do not require bosses. Anarchy keeps infrastructure without bosses.
Voting puts bosses in place to make decisions. Anarchy prefers consensus building between effected parties.
People deserve to make more decisions in how their lives are run. A lack of respect for laws passed by our bosses is fitting.
Voting for bosses that make laws to chain people who can run their own school or hospital is unnecesary. Vote because it is the extent of power afforded to us now. Concurrently build better systems and power structures like anarchy.
I think you mean anarchism.
I don’t think you know what anarchism means.
Also, governments can build infrastructure without supporting foreign genocide.
The Original Commenter (OC) of this thread isn’t saying they want to abolish government entirely. They are saying that government has been twisted and no longer represents the wishes of its people.
I don’t know maybe it is better. Yes many will die horribly but already is, just in another part of the world because of governments that are being used as tongs by billionaires
As American, I’m always so glad to see our cousins across the water follow our inane footsteps. Cheers Brits!
Cross Atlantic solidarity against fascism 🤝
Atleast we’re in solidarity about being fucked off
Brexit? They were first.
Palestine Action are heroes. We should be singing songs about them, not prosecuting them.
Remember, legality and morality are only vaguely related. Beyond the natural crimes of murder, rape, etc. laws are just politics by another name. And the wealthy and powerful write laws to advance their own corrupt interests. Many moral obligations are criminalized, and many things that if there is a Hell will surely get you sent there are perfectly legal.
Those planes deserved to be vandalized. Hell, they deserved to be set on fire. It’s a shame they weren’t destroyed completely. If those planes are being used to carry out a genocide, then they should be destroyed. That is the simple absolute moral truth. If the law says otherwise, then the law is wrong. Anyone violating it still needs to keep the consequences in mind. But outside observers should not be afraid to speak truth to power. What Palestine Action did was not wrong; it was an act of heroism. The UK should be electing these people to parliament, not prosecuting them. Want courageous leaders who will actually stand up to powerful interests and do the right thing, even when it’s hard? Well it seems you just found that exact rare kind of person right here.
Destroying planes that are bound to assist in bombing in Gaza is simply the morally right thing to do, regardless of the law. It’s no different than a Jewish resistance fighter in the 1940s setting fire to a cattle train about to go collect prisoners for transport to Dachau. Sometimes destruction of government property is the only morally correct choice available to people.
And we shouldn’t be afraid to say this. People in the UK should be contacting their politicians demanding a full pardon for these heroes.
Those planes deserved to be vandalized. Hell, they deserved to be set on fire. It’s a shame they weren’t destroyed completely. If those planes are being used to carry out a genocide, then they should be destroyed.
The planes were totally unrelated to what’s going on in Gaza.
Destroying planes that are bound to assist in bombing in Gaza
What’s the indication these planes would do that? Israel doesn’t even need British tanker planes to fly the tiny distance to Gaza.
Can you support “the political prisoners of Palestine Action”?
Can you say “Palestine Action is not a terrorist organization”?
Can you say “Outlawing Palestine Action is terrorism”?
Or is that also illegal?
Fucking fascists… A sad end to the Labour Party, but it was clear what would happen after they stabbed Corbyn in the back.
Hold up one saying “I support Yevette Cooper”, i doubt they’ll arrest you for that.
Fascists? Virtually the entire house of commons voted them a terrorist organisation, not just Labour. That was because they attacked UK military aircraft on a UK military base and concocted an excuse for doing it. That got them branded terrorists.
This does not in any way stop people rallying for Palestine or the appalling inhuman injustices they’re suffering. I’m sure there are marches happening all the time, not to mention charities to donate to, social media feeds to amplify atrocities. Just don’t attack UK bases or support those who do and you’ll be fine.
As for Corbyn, he wasn’t “stabbed in the back”. He lost two general elections in a row and he resigned. If he was still there for the last election he’d be sitting in opposition in charge of an even smaller party surrounded by a clique. He was not some saviour for Labour, he was the bane of it.
“Terrorism, in its broadest sense, is the use of violence against non-combatants to achieve political or ideological aims.”
If you call this terrorism, you can call anything terrorism, and anybody can be a terrorist. If you’re willing to do that to aid the Israel fascist state, that makes you a fascist. Yes, the entire house of commons are fascists.
And sure, that was very much illegal and they could have used any number of laws applicable to attacking a military base. Just not terrorism. But the UK military is involved in a partnership in the gaza war. They are not “non-combatants”
It’s what UK law considers terrorism.
the military does not deserve any protection from citizens and should never be an excuse to call people terrorists.
Right. Doesn’t change the fact about UK law considering their actions terroristic… You know, what this thread is about.
The thread’s about the law being akin to the law of a police state. A state is a police state if it enforces unjust laws that criminalise reasonable acts.
Only antisemites think genocide is bad. /s
from what ive been hearing from the shit going on in the uk, youve been a police state for a while now.
Even if they were trying to use this sort of rule with wholesome intentions, I’m not sure how targeting groups by name instead of deed makes sense. It’s like doing a healthy diet by giving up Coca-Cola by name even though Pepsi and RC have the same nutritional profile and availability. Enjoy the Whack-a-mole game!
Taken to its logical conclusion, someone should start a pro-Palestinian squad and call it the Reform Party.
The group in question broke onto an airbase and put a couple of RAF planes out of action. They crossed a red line for the government.
Oh boy wait till you hear what the suffragettes were willing to do for another righteous cause, a bit over a century ago. I don’t know man, maybe the government should start reexamining its policies if ordinary people among its citizens are willing to start breaking into airbase and damaging their own planes.
They were willing to commit mass murder in London and Dublin, and to assassinate the Prime Minister. Also deeply keen on removing all Jews from the House of Commons. Things that today would indeed mark them as a terrorist organisation.
Later, Emmeline Pankhurst would found a political party with the aim of requiring all civil servants to prove their racial purity back at least 3 generations, and many of the more prominent members of the WSPU became prominent members of the British fascist movement, several being detained as a precaution during the second European fuss.
As a campaign, the WSPU was an abject failure. It put women’s votes back a decade, and Pankhurst failed to ensure that working class women were excluded from the franchise (she also wanted working class men excluded).
It was only a cataclysm the scale of WWI, and the groundwork of the suffragists working in opposition to the suffragettes, which brought votes for all.
Sounds like a classic case of both the moderates and the radicals being essential for any real change. The moderates are the hammer and the extremists are the anvil.
Society is like a bar of iron. It’s stuck in its shape and resists change. Non-violent moderate protest alone is like a hammer without an anvil. You strike the iron, but the iron ignores the blow. With moderate protest alone, the established powers simply ignore the protests. They bend and duck out of the way and nothing changes. But violent groups serve as the anvil. They hold the powers that be in place and prevent them from ducking away from the hammer blow of the moderates.
Both hammer and anvil are needed. Without the violent extremists, the moderates are simply painted as extremists and ignored. With them, the moderates can actually gain traction. Moderate protest movements don’t succeed unless there is also a violent wing. Moderates are only moderate if there is something to moderate against. Without the violent extremists, the moderates will be the ones labeled criminals and arrested, regardless of how extreme their tactics actually are.
The Suffragettes did nothing to advance the cause, quite the opposite. They poisoned centrist politicians against suffrage, confirmed the claims of the opponents talking about “mad women”, and made it hard for supporters of suffrage to make progress. On the other hand, they failed in their aims to hound out Jewish MPs from Parliament, and at the height of their bombing campaign Britain enjoyed the lowest insurance claim year in history.
It’s very likely women would have got the vote sooner if the militants just… didn’t. We’d be better off without immature hotheads spoiling for a bit of violence.
Nothing they did makes them terrorists, no matter what you think of the action they took
They caused £7 million pounds damage. Now if someone damaged YOUR property and the police did nothing how would you feel? As the £7 million will now have to be found from tax payers money can you not see why the government is pissed… regardless of the cause this sort of action has consequences.
Nobody said there shouldn’t be consequences, but they have been labeled as terrorists, which is not a fair or correct response.
And… I never said anything about that. If you do something, there are consequences. Those consequences vary but when it is a large sum of money quite often the consequences are disproportionate to the crime (and we can all agree it is a crime, in the literal sense)
So in other words you had nothing to add to what we were actually talking about and decided you wanted to talk about something else instead?
If someone damaged my property, I’d feel pretty aggrieved… and it still wouldn’t make them a terrorist. And the police wouldn’t do nothing, because damaging property is a crime. That property being a few planes doesn’t magically change the equation. Just like the government wouldn’t be doing nothing if they hadn’t designated PA as a terrorist organisation, because a whole raft of criminal charges would still apply.
Literally, and I want to stress this, literally nobody has suggested that PA should not face appropriate and proportionate consequences for their actions. And you knew that. You knew damed well that people have no problem with the government taking action, as long as that action is legal and democratically responsible. Yet you deliberately chose to dishonestly equate opposition to terrorist designation with support for them getting off scot free, even though that’s an obviously false and mendacious equivalence.
You are not very skilled at this dishonesty malarkey. Consider yourself called out.
Eh? I never said that, I just said there are consequences and people are up in arms… You took what I said and ran with it. Should they do nothing about damage that tax payers will have to pay? Really should they? I never said it wasn’t terrorism either or in fact never said it wasn’t… I’m way more aggrieved they took the winter fuel payment away from my 82 yr old mother because it directly affects me. I was pointing out, simply, that it was £7 million pounds plus damages. 7 million. Tax payers will have to pay that somehow because that is how the military is funded, directly or indirectly. Now consider yourself being called out for trying to shame me when I was just saying it is a large figure - nothing more, nothing less. Whether I feel it is proportional or not is not what I meant and you damn well know it as well, you are just as guilty of what you accuse me of. Go try and shame someone else
if someone damaged YOUR property
I’m not supporting a genocide, why would someone damage my property?
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Ah “liar”. They were tankers, not fighter jets. And paint thrown in an engine requires the engine to be completely stripped down for parts to be inspected and cleaned because it’s a plane not a lawnmower. They also went at the planes with a crowbar.
Still not terrorism
An attack on military assets for a political aim.
No , terrorism is targetting civilians for political aim
So the beheading of Lee Rigby wasn’t terrorism? Your definition doesn’t match the law or the dictionary.
What this has to do with palestine action?
In 2003, anti-war activists broke into RAF Fairford to stop US bombers heading to Iraq and didn’t get any terrorism charge. It’s pretty clear that it’s all about crushing real actions against genocide
That’s over 20 years ago, before 7/7 changed strategy.
Uk has the obligation to stop all military cooperation with israel that’s the big crimes that people involved in should be in jail for up to 15 years
So, not terrorism
out of action
paint
Paint and crowbars. The engines will have to be stripped down and rebuilt.
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Even on the middle east eye YouTube I’m seeing so many appeals to authority and “it’s illegal, simple as. Full stop. Not for debate”.
Not sure if brigading or what but it really worries me how people think.
It’s not like they’re stupid, it’s like it’s uncomfortable for them to think.
The moron, Yvette Cooper thinks that this is the sort of violent thug that needs to be locked up whilst neo nazi and other hate groups causing direct harm to (checks notes) voters continues unabated.
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/1536/cpsprodpb/8d95/live/2ee739a0-59ba-11f0-9074-8989d8c97d87.jpg.webp
Two neo-Nazi groups were proscribed at the same time…
There’s a palpable difference in daily harms to UK residents, whether physical or online.
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BBC News - 29 arrests after protest in support of Palestine Action, police say https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4gd3pkr9x1o
Whomp… Whomp…! Unfortunately Fascism is real!
They’re feckless cowards.
Sux
They could just say I support Palestine and be fine.
But then they won’t be able to impress their basement friends with their edginess.
